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2017 Proposed Rule Changes for Member Comment.

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  • RallyKeith
    replied
    When can we expect the rules to be published?

    Leave a comment:


  • Pete
    replied
    You'd need to import the whole car. At least, my interpretation of the rules is, the vehicle must match the VIN, the only things that can be installed post-factory besides allowable comfort & convenience items (like port- or dealer-installed A/C) are complete option packages. An STI isn't an option package, it's a different car.

    I've seen someone enter a Lancia Delta Integrale in SA, nobody complained

    Realistically speaking, a car like that is going to be very rare/expensive/difficult to repair, so I see this rule as being less exclusionary. I doubt that there are any "ringer" vehicles not already on these shores, or that anybody would, say, spend $50k+ to get a bluetop Cossie to rallycross it. While entirely awesome, it's also extremely impractical.

    Leave a comment:


  • gsxnut
    replied
    Originally posted by slowautoxr View Post
    The RXB just made JDM swaps legal for Stock.

    So if you've swapped your stock vehicle and now it is exactly like the JDM counter part, you could be legal to run in the Stock class.




    3.1 ELIGIBLE VEHICLES
    A RallyCross event is open to any fixed-roof, four-wheeled, mass-produced passenger vehicle (including convertibles with a factory hardtop attached, targa-types with factory panel in place, t‐tops with factory panels in place) that can pass safety inspection. A vehicle that meets the definition above but was not originally sold in the United States (e.g. Canada, Japan/JDM or Europe-only vehicle) is eligible if it meets applicable safety and preparation allowance requirements. If the Event Chairman after consultation with the Event Safety Steward determines at his discretion that a vehicle cannot safely negotiate the course, it may be excluded. The following types of vehicles are currently not eligible to compete: ATVs, UTVs, side-by-sides, Trophy Trucks, Crosskarts, Formula Cross, Legend cars and tube‐frame vehicles.

    PASSED 7-0.

    I think the key word here is "EXACTLY" and the owner should be prepared to prove by documentation the car is "EXACTLY" as it was produced and sold in the country it is being claimed to be sold in. So if your thinking about a GC8 STI Swap make sure you get all the parts not just the motor and transmission.

    Leave a comment:


  • slowautoxr
    replied
    The RXB just made JDM swaps legal for Stock.

    So if you've swapped your stock vehicle and now it is exactly like the JDM counter part, you could be legal to run in the Stock class.




    3.1 ELIGIBLE VEHICLES
    A RallyCross event is open to any fixed-roof, four-wheeled, mass-produced passenger vehicle (including convertibles with a factory hardtop attached, targa-types with factory panel in place, t‐tops with factory panels in place) that can pass safety inspection. A vehicle that meets the definition above but was not originally sold in the United States (e.g. Canada, Japan/JDM or Europe-only vehicle) is eligible if it meets applicable safety and preparation allowance requirements. If the Event Chairman after consultation with the Event Safety Steward determines at his discretion that a vehicle cannot safely negotiate the course, it may be excluded. The following types of vehicles are currently not eligible to compete: ATVs, UTVs, side-by-sides, Trophy Trucks, Crosskarts, Formula Cross, Legend cars and tube‐frame vehicles.

    PASSED 7-0.

    Leave a comment:


  • Blakely
    replied
    Everyone who participates in RallyCross should take the time to think about not only these proposals, but where our sport could be in a few years. Don't just think about the class you compete in or even the prep level. Rather think about whether something is good for the sport or just the person proposing a rule change.

    1) no
    2) no
    3) yes
    4) common sense, at Hastings one year, a VW rolled and made repairs which allowed it to still compete.
    5) no
    6) yes
    7) no
    8) no, where does this stop? As an example, car with 19" wheels could only go down to 18", not much difference. It only makes sense that the following proposal would be to allow +-2", it's called rules creep for a reason.
    9) yes
    10) yes
    11) yes
    12) yes
    13) no, convertibles are not the same as hardtop vehicles
    14) yes
    15) yes
    16) no
    17) no
    18) no
    19) no, people think 50 mph is slow on dirt. Set up a RallyCross course that can reach that speed and it will make sense why 60 is too fast for RallyCross. Remember, the rule states "does not normally exceed 50 mph" I love to go fast, but there's a time and a place.

    Leave a comment:


  • EvanB
    replied
    1. Clarify that non-U.S. vehicles are “eligible vehicles”.
      Fine, as long as they are legally imported (over 25 years).
    2. Add guidance on how to address cracked/broken windshields.
      Does this need to be a rule? Guidance is fine.
    3. Allow tires with Canadian DOT/TIN to be used on Canada-registered vehicles.
      Should be allowed for all vehicles, not just canada-registered.
    4. Allow removal of rear seats and interior components to accommodate roll cage/bar installation in Stock.
      If a roll cage is added that could be a lot of interior components removed.
    5. Allow +/- 1” wheel diameter variance in Stock OR allow any size wheel in Stock.
      Allow any size wheel in stock if nothing is changed to make them fit OR allow any diameter.
    6. Allow removal of rear window in convertible hardtops OR allow removal of rear window in hardtop if vehicle is equipped with a roll cage in Modified.
      Option 2, but it should be roll cage OR bar.
    7. Allow windshield to be replaced with wire mesh or bracing if vehicle is equipped with roll cage in Modified.
      No
    8. Allow any aerodynamic device in Modified.
      Yes, although I don't know why this needs to be clarified.
    9. Allow exhaust to exit to the side of the vehicle in front of the driver in Modified.
      Yes.
    10. Add new class for AWD/4WD vehicles with OEM active differentials.
      No
    11. Eliminate parade laps and only allow course walks.
      Since the course can change so much over a few runs and course walks are not allowed in between run groups the parade laps should be kept.
    12. Change maximum speed guideline from “not normally exceed 50 mph” back to 60 mph.
      Yes


    Leave a comment:


  • Pete
    replied
    Originally posted by gsxnut View Post
    Smaller Brake Swap and keep the 114.3 x 5 wheel hubs roughly $2000
    Oh, but I found a junkyardable way to do this without spending $600+ per rear brake rotor... closer to $65, if you pay retail for new ones...

    Makes me want to get a Subaru of my own again!

    Leave a comment:


  • krautastic
    replied
    1. Clarify that non-U.S. vehicles are “eligible vehicles”. -- Non-us vehicles should be legal in mod but not in any other class. This includes canadians participants using a vehicle that doesn't have a direct US equivalent. There are so many rules intermingled in the rules for stock/prepared about visual option packages and performance packages, that the whole package must be installed. This either means that a non-us vehicle must convert all items over to a US model of the same year, or it opens it up the other way, that a stock 1996 subaru legacy can engine swap and interior swap to a twin turbo japanese subaru legacy because it is a 'stock non-us vehicle.'
    2. Prohibit non-OEM roll cages/roll bars in Stock. -- I think the weight of a roll cage far outweighs (ha!) any performance gain. If a person wants to feel safer with a cage, then they should be able to do so. Since there are no rules for cages in prepared, this rule inadvertently applies to prepared vehicles as well. Disallowing cages in stock, means only mod cars can run one.
    3. Drop Snell 2000 helmets from eligibility and allow ECE (European standard) helmets to be consistent with Solo helmet rules. -- Agree.
    4. Add guidance on how to address cracked/broken windshields. -- As others have stated, a crack which does not obstruct visibility does not pose a safety risk in my opinion, and it would be far too easy to get a crack in travel to a national event. I don't want to see this as the easy way to protest out a competitor. Not to mention the inherent risk of receiving a crack through rocks being thrown by the car in front of you starting.
    5. Allow tires with Canadian DOT/TIN to be used on Canada-registered vehicles. -- Do not allow. There was already a problem at nats last year with re-skinned tires that had the proper markings but weren't actually legal. I don't think US competitors and staff should need to learn canadian tire codes and the potential crossovers where all of a sudden a canadian rally tire is appearing in stock. I think most people make exceptions to rules at regional events and I think that type of sportsmanship should continue, and if someone shows up from canada to race, that group is adult enough to have them compete in the appropriate class.
    6. Allow removal of rear seats and interior components to accommodate roll cage/bar installation in Stock. -- stolen from above: I like the rule as written, where you remove the minimum amount necessary to install the bar/cage.
    7. Allow +/- 1” wheel diameter variance in Stock OR allow any size wheel in Stock. -- Stock should allow +/-1" in diameter to mimic autocross rules. I feel stock cars play well where they can translate between autocross and rallycross and that is a good thing. Also, its 2016, which means a car made in 2006 is now 10 years old. In the mid 2000's oversized wheels became the norm for manufacturers and not only are tires in these sizes hard to find, but the amount of tire sidewall can be detrimental to keep the wheel round and usable. I would also like to see the allowance of +/-.5 inch in width. Rallycross is not like autocross where you are trying to run the widest possible race slick. In rallycross narrow widths can be good, but it is not the huge deciding factor. opening up the diameter and width really helps racers find wheels for their cars which have oddball sizes 240sx with its 15x6.5" wheels comes to mind. Or mazda RX8 with 17" and 18" diameter wheels with very limited snow tire options.
    8. Allow snorkels and body modification for routing intake tubes for mid/rear-engine cars in Prepared. -- I fully support this rule as a prepared driver with a rear engine vehicle, but I believe the rule should read tighter, like the roll cage rule, that the minimum amount of material should be removed to accommodate the modification. I don't see a reason to forbid front engined vehicles from doing this, as I don't see a huge benefit to these cars. I do see the rule as a whole is in opposition to Prepared vehicles appearing as showroom stock vehicles on the exterior (ie: the rules as written is ground effects, spoilers, and hood scoops must be OEM components) and a snorkel or exterior snorkel is in opposition to this. I would overall like to see prepared allow for a more open visual modification allowance where this would fit in better, but that's another story and another year proposal.
    9. Allow AWD/4WD to substitute any/all differentials with limited slip/locking units in Prepared. -- undecided... I don't agree with the argument that 2wd cars get to replace "all of their differentials" and so all wheel drive vehicles should be able to do the same. I don't think that is a fair comparison/equivalence, as a single differential change can make a significant impact to performance and thats what the rule seems to carry with it. Then gain, it may make cars more competitive with active diff cars like the evo, and I can support that.
    10. Allow addition of oil catch tanks in Prepared. -- No brainer, no performance gain, only an engine protection measure, I support this.
    11. Allow modification of fenders and doors to accommodate larger wheels/tires in Modified.-- Agreed, don't know how this isn't already allowed.
    12. Allow removal of rear window in convertible hardtops OR allow removal of rear window in hardtop if vehicle is equipped with a roll cage in Modified.-- Just tried to open the link to read this rule in its entirety and the link is dead. I would say if the window is replaced with lexan or similar and it is not integral to the structure of the hard top then I support it in mod class only. The thing I've always heard is that roll bars don't make much of a difference in convertibles in rally, that they shovel into the dirt, and that hard tops distribute the load over a greater area resulting in more rollover safety, so if removing the rear window compromises the hard top, then the roll bar may not be enough.
    13. Allow windshield to be replaced with wire mesh or bracing if vehicle is equipped with roll cage in Modified. -- as above, no objection, but without a windshield, a face shield or goggles should be worn too.
    14. Allow any aerodynamic device in Modified. -- I feel like mod is the unlimited class where it states the car must resemble a factory car. Therefore I think aero should be unlimited as the speeds do not allow for the aero to make a difference, and if there's no allowance here for it, then a car with aftermarket appearance parts would have no where to compete.
    15. Allow exhaust to exit to the side of the vehicle in front of the driver in Modified. -- Do not allow. This I think is an unnecessary safety risk for anyone that may be trying to attend to a driver involved in a wreck or rollover, or even drivers walking through grid who may not be aware of an unusual exhaust exit. Also opens up things like hood exit exhaust which can obscure forward vision.
    16. Add new class for AWD/4WD vehicles with OEM active differentials. -- Nope. Plenty of drivers have won against these cars in the past.
    17. Eliminate parade laps and only allow course walks. -- No. Parade laps help knock down vegetation in vegetation heavy regions. Also, it allows for people to see course changes that may have occurred since they were able to walk (ie: second heat drivers). It takes less time to do a parade lap than to have everyone walk to course to see course changes. I do believe that regions should be stricter on the time to get cars out on course. A parade lap is a privaledge, not a right. You must make it to paddock by a set time, and if you don't then you don't get a parade lap.
    18. Change maximum speed guideline from “not normally exceed 50 mph” back to 60 mph -- No objection. The verbage doesn't carry alot of weight with it in comparison to safety stewards and course designers' judgements.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kentobeanz
    replied
    I like this rules process, it gets a lot of people involved. My thoughts are below, but keep in mind I play in Mod so the Stock/Prepared rules don't normally apply to me:
    1. Clarify that non-U.S. vehicles are “eligible vehicles”. -- Could be difficult for a competitor to prove stock legality with foreign language documentation. No objection for regional events, but I don't think they're a good fit for Stock at National events.
    2. Prohibit non-OEM roll cages/roll bars in Stock. -- In 2014 Leon's Rabbit had one of the harshest rollovers I've seen at a RallyCross event, and the roof of the car wasn't touching the cage afterward. I don't think roll bars/cages are necessary at RallyCross speeds, but I don't think the rules should discourage or ban them. Keep the rule as written, and allow minimum mods to install the roll bar/cage.
    3. Drop Snell 2000 helmets from eligibility and allow ECE (European standard) helmets to be consistent with Solo helmet rules. -- Agree
    4. Add guidance on how to address cracked/broken windshields. -- If the crack obscures vision to the point Ace Ventura has to hang out the window to see, it's a safety issue. Otherwise, leave it alone. At some point I'll be able to bring my own car at a National event, and my drive to just about anywhere in the central US will be around 3500 miles each way. It would really suck to get a minor crack somewhere along the way, that has no affect on visibility in my rubber-gasketed windshield, and then be denied entry because a no-crack rule is made for a few cars that might use the windshield as structure.
    5. Allow tires with Canadian DOT/TIN to be used on Canada-registered vehicles. -- At regional events, sure. Stick with US DOT for Stock at National events. I don't know enough about CanadianDOT tire markings, but maybe add a provision where the entrant must prove the Canadian tire is completely equivalent to US DOT but stamped differently? The key is to avoid a Canadian-only tire that is faster than all US tires (I don't know whether that would even exist), and would give an advantage that's not available to all competitors.
    6. Add examples of allowable and non-allowable protective equipment. -- No comment, no objection.
    7. Allow removal of rear seats and interior components to accommodate roll cage/bar installation in Stock. -- I like the rule as written, where you remove the minimum amount necessary to install the bar/cage. Cars ran roll cages in Showroom Stock for a long time with nearly full interiors, it can be done. That said, removal of the rear seat is offset by the weight of the cage, so probably not a big deal performance-wise. Removal of interior components is too vague, and opens a can of worms that starts to stray too far from Stock or even Prepared. If you want to gut the car for a cage, jump to Mod.
    8. Allow +/- 1” wheel diameter variance in Stock OR allow any size wheel in Stock. -- I like the idea of stock width, +/-10mm offset, and +/-1" for diameter.
    9. Allow snorkels and body modification for routing intake tubes for mid/rear-engine cars in Prepared. -- I don't play in Prepared, so I don't object. But, knowing there's probably no advantage for front engine cars either, why not open it up to all?
    10. Allow AWD/4WD to substitute any/all differentials with limited slip/locking units in Prepared. -- Yes. It can get expensive, but it could be easier to throw 3 diffs at a car rather than experimenting to see which ONE works best.
    11. Allow addition of oil catch tanks in Prepared. -- I support this
    12. Allow modification of fenders and doors to accommodate larger wheels/tires in Modified.-- YES!
    13. Allow removal of rear window in convertible hardtops OR allow removal of rear window in hardtop if vehicle is equipped with a roll cage in Modified.-- I like it, but only because this could be a good opportunity for rules-creep in the future, and a step towards allowing aftermarket tops on convertibles with full cages. But, if the manufacturers say the window is part of the top for strength, I suppose it should stay.
    14. Allow windshield to be replaced with wire mesh or bracing if vehicle is equipped with roll cage in Modified. -- No objection, but without a windshield, a face shield or goggles should be worn too.
    15. Allow any aerodynamic device in Modified. -- YES! We already have several cars running aftermarket aero, and have for years. There isn't much aero forces at typical RallyCross speeds, so the rules should let them run legally.
    16. Allow exhaust to exit to the side of the vehicle in front of the driver in Modified. -- No objection.
    17. Add new class for AWD/4WD vehicles with OEM active differentials. -- Do we call this new class Warren Mod or Max Mod? No. I'd much rather see an unlimited class that allows tube frames, homebuilts, buggies, and other fun stuff that meets safety rules.
    18. Eliminate parade laps and only allow course walks. -- The proposed change as written in the PDF doesn't eliminate the parade lap, it just eliminates the option for a person who may not be able to walk to drive the course prior to the official parade lap. Keep the option open for those who can't walk. I'm indifferent on a parade lap. It's helpful, but not necessary.
    19. Change maximum speed guideline from “not normally exceed 50 mph” back to 60 mph -- YES

    Leave a comment:


  • gsxnut
    replied
    Originally posted by woodrufj View Post

    ---Allow AWD/4WD to substitute any/all differentials with limited slip/locking units in Prepared.
    No, big increase in the cost of competition. (Hey Mark, one could also say "If PF and PR are allowed to change ONE diff so should PA be allowed") :-)


    Jay W
    So I was checking around and I can get a LSD clutch type diff for my STI for about $1200 x 2 = $2400.

    If I bought a set of Rally Wheels and Tires approx $2000
    Header and Exhaust Roughly $2000
    Smaller Brake Swap and keep the 114.3 x 5 wheel hubs roughly $2000
    Decent set of shocks and Springs with Skid plates roughly $2000

    All of these other modifications are allowed in PA and we don't seem to be too worried about the cost. My point is that if you allow a differential change to level the playing field in FWD and RWD why would you not do the same in PA?

    One could also just remove the allowance all together if cost is the biggest concern.

    Mark

    Leave a comment:


  • woodrufj
    replied
    Originally posted by dirtman View Post
    Don't 2 & 7 contradict each other since there is no OEM roll cage or even roll bar available for sedans and coupes unless your buying some $100k+ special.
    Yeah, but these are individual proposals, not a "Package" of rule changes. So its okay the contradict, I'm sure the RXB won't apply them that way.

    Jay W

    Leave a comment:


  • woodrufj
    replied
    My comments are all aimed at National Level event rules. Regional events should be allowed to modify non-Safety rules as they fit.

    ---Clarify that non-U.S. vehicles are “eligible vehicles”.
    I don't think non-US vehicles should be eligible. Can of worms with thousands more available vehicles that would cost much more than normal market value to import. Difficulties in Spec documentation can be expected as well.


    ---Prohibit non-OEM roll cages/roll bars in Stock.
    Nope. Minor performance benefits, big 'peace of mind'. I know of two middle aged AutoXer who's mothers MADE them put roll cages in stockish cars.


    ---Drop Snell 2000 helmets from eligibility and allow ECE (European standard) helmets to be consistent with Solo helmet rules.
    Yes, and more. Why not just copy and paste the Solo rules here?


    ---Add guidance on how to address cracked/broken windshields.
    Not really a proposal without words on what that guidance would be. My rule of thumb, no-breach, okay.


    ---Allow tires with Canadian DOT/TIN to be used on Canada-registered vehicles.
    No, same reasoning as the non-US spec cars above. (regionals do whatever they want here)


    ---Add examples of allowable and non-allowable protective equipment.
    Has there been an issue? If not, leave it alone.


    ---Allow removal of rear seats and interior components to accommodate roll cage/bar installation in Stock.
    Nope. Opens a lot of ambiguity in what is necessary to pull for the cage. Also, how many members are really clamoring for cages in stock class? Solo has survived with such rules for a very long time, and they tend to drive nicer cars.


    ---Allow +/- 1” wheel diameter variance in Stock OR allow any size wheel in Stock.
    1.) I like stock to remain stock. 2.) There would be an inequity the advantage provided. Most modern cars can't go -1 for brake clearance.


    ---Allow snorkels and body modification for routing intake tubes for mid/rear-engine cars in Prepared.
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe snorkels are allowed in prepared, but you just can't do illegal stuff to accommodate them (like the mentioned body modifications). I don't think this is appropriate for "Prepared" class. Regardless, if this rule is written, I recommend it be applied universally to prepared cars, not restricted to mid/rear-engine cars as written here.


    ---Allow AWD/4WD to substitute any/all differentials with limited slip/locking units in Prepared.
    No, big increase in the cost of competition. (Hey Mark, one could also say "If PF and PR are allowed to change ONE diff so should PA be allowed") :-)


    ---Allow addition of oil catch tanks in Prepared.
    ...That serve no other purpose...


    ---Allow modification of fenders and doors to accommodate larger wheels/tires in Modified.
    This feels more like a clarification on the slightly murky "body" rules. Maybe revisit that whole section to make it clear the body can be completely reworked/replaced for really any reason while staying within the "recognizable" rule.


    ---Allow removal of rear window in convertible hardtops OR allow removal of rear window in hardtop if vehicle is equipped with a roll cage in Modified.
    Part 1 - Yes, but for selfish reason. If this is a safety item, so be it. But I'd call for looking at a way to equalize this rule across all cars in the category. Currently any closed car remove/replace the rear glass, but open cars (w/ hard top) can not (inequity). Devise a lowest common denominator rule that lumps all the cars together. Suggestions in my order of preference, subject to safety scrutiny: "All cars may remove rear glass", "All cars may substitute but not remove rear glass", "All cars may remove/subatitue rear glass if a roll bar is used", "All cars may not replace rear glass"


    ---Allow windshield to be replaced with wire mesh or bracing if vehicle is equipped with roll cage in Modified.
    This feels along the lines of tube frames and "specials" which considered to be beyond the scope of Mod class. I'd suggest this rule for the "Uber" class likely to come sooner or later.


    ---Allow any aerodynamic device in Modified.
    Yes, this was probably an over site previously.


    ---Allow exhaust to exit to the side of the vehicle in front of the driver in Modified.
    I can't put my finger on exactly why, but I don't like it. Slightly unsafe to idle this way, slightly unsafe to workers not expecting the exhaust to exit on their shins. Opens doors for ear bleeding systems. Maybe an allowance for the "Uber" class again.


    ---Add new class for AWD/4WD vehicles with OEM active differentials.
    No, this is an exclusion list in disguise. Would like to see an "uber" class proposal. For modification beyond Mod (tube framed, crazy body mods), specials and odd ducks (foreign spec).


    ---Eliminate parade laps and only allow course walks.
    Yes, but I'd leave the door open for addition in supp regs. National sites are not all the same, and many can benefit from a parade lap (knock down grass, create a "line", work in some water, etc)


    ---Change maximum speed guideline from “not normally exceed 50 mph” back to 60 mph.
    Yes, but this was my proposal :-). Here was my rationale: Reasons given to reduce the speed limit for the 2016 rules were lacking in relevance to RallyCross safety requirements or spirit. To my knowledge the speed reduction was not at the direction (or request) of risk management nor was it related to any persistent safety issue. Emerging programs should not effect the RallyCross rule set.


    Jay W
    Last edited by woodrufj; 08-24-2016, 05:44 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • dirtman
    replied
    Don't 2 & 7 contradict each other since there is no OEM roll cage or even roll bar available for sedans and coupes unless your buying some $100k+ special.

    Leave a comment:


  • gsxnut
    replied
    1. Clarify that non-U.S. vehicles are “eligible vehicles”.
      1. Bring it with the foreign cars but if they are going to run in stock they need to bring documentation showing they meet stock class requirements.
    2. Prohibit non-OEM roll cages/roll bars in Stock.
      1. I would keep the allowance to have a rollbar in Stock. Safety First.
    3. Drop Snell 2000 helmets from eligibility and allow ECE (European standard) helmets to be consistent with Solo helmet rules.
      1. Don't know enough about ECE helmets but it is acceptable to be consistent with Solo.
    4. Add guidance on how to address cracked/broken windshields.
      1. I think we should add clarification. Safety is still the most important and one crack here or there may not be an issue but a crack that create an obstruction is a problem. I think we could look to what States DOTs currently do during inspections as a general rule.
    5. Allow tires with Canadian DOT/TIN to be used on Canada-registered vehicles.
      1. Change to "Allow tires with Canadian DOT/TIN to be used." I don't think we should distinguish by where the car is registered. What if someone brings a Canadian car to Nationals? Do they have more options than a US registered car?
    6. Add examples of allowable and non-allowable protective equipment.
      1. Okay
    7. Allow removal of rear seats and interior components to accommodate roll cage/bar installation in Stock.
      1. Okay. the Roll bar will weight more than the seats most likely. I don't see a weight advantage if you are allowing the roll bar for safety. It could however increase the rigidity of the car and create a performance advantage by adding the roll bar.
    8. Allow +/- 1” wheel diameter variance in Stock OR allow any size wheel in Stock.
      1. Agreed with this based on the case made by Jim Rowland.
    9. Allow snorkels and body modification for routing intake tubes for mid/rear-engine cars in Prepared.
      1. No on this one. To much variation allowed for snorkels and body work for only mid/rear engine cars.
    10. Allow AWD/4WD to substitute any/all differentials with limited slip/locking units in Prepared.
      1. Completely agree with this. It has nothing to do with STI's and EVOs. It have everything to do with making the rules equitable in all classes. If PF and PR are allowed to change all diffs so should PA be allowed.
    11. Allow addition of oil catch tanks in Prepared.
      1. Agree with this.
    12. Allow modification of fenders and doors to accommodate larger wheels/tires in Modified.
      1. No additional rules required.
    13. Allow removal of rear window in convertible hardtops OR allow removal of rear window in hardtop if vehicle is equipped with a roll cage in Modified.
      1. I have no opinion on this either way.
    14. Allow windshield to be replaced with wire mesh or bracing if vehicle is equipped with roll cage in Modified.
      1. I think this should be allowed. It is allowed in many other forms of racing and does not appear to cause an issue with vision obstructions. If they use them on dirt track cars that go 2-3 times as fast why would we have an issue with this? This may also open up the class to many dirt track cars that may want to run from the stock classes. I do agree on the closed face helmet should be added.
    15. Allow any aerodynamic device in Modified.
      1. I have no issues with having these devices.
    16. Allow exhaust to exit to the side of the vehicle in front of the driver in Modified.
      1. I do not see any reason to add this. No on this one.
    17. Add new class for AWD/4WD vehicles with OEM active differentials.
      1. No on a new class. If there are dominant cars than so be it. I think the class structure as is works very well and for most regions where the majority of the racing occurs the car counts are small. Segregating the classes does not seem to benefit the sport.
    18. Eliminate parade laps and only allow course walks.
      1. Disagree, Parade laps should remain.
    19. Change maximum speed guideline from “not normally exceed 50 mph” back to 60 mph.
      1. I am OK with 60 mph. I don't see it changing much in the grand scheme of things.

    Last edited by gsxnut; 08-04-2016, 09:03 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Brian
    replied
    First, thanks for giving everyone a change to input opinions. I'm sure this is not the most fun part of the job.

    1 Clarify that non-U.S. vehicles are “eligible vehicles
    Agreed

    2 Prohibit non-OEM roll cages/roll bars in Stock.
    NO I see no good reason to limit safety and OEM might be more $

    3 Drop Snell 2000 helmets from eligibility and allow ECE (European standard) helmets to be consistent with Solo helmet rules.
    Agreed

    4 Add guidance on how to address cracked/broken windshields.
    NO

    5 Allow tires with Canadian DOT/TIN to be used on Canada-registered vehicles.
    Agreed but remove "allowed on Canada-registered vehicles" if one person can use them then everyone should be able to.

    6 Add examples of allowable and non-allowable protective equipment.
    no comment

    7 Allow removal of rear seats and interior components to accommodate roll cage/bar installation in Stock.
    no comment

    8 Allow +/- 1” wheel diameter variance in Stock OR allow any size wheel in Stock.
    Agreed maybe add =/- 1" width as well

    9 Allow snorkels and body modification for routing intake tubes for mid/rear-engine cars in Prepared.
    Agreed

    10 Allow AWD/4WD to substitute any/all differentials with limited slip/locking units in Prepared.
    Agreed This gives the guys in WRXs, RS, lancer, etc an oppurtinity to put themselves on a level playing field with the STis and evos.

    11 Allow addition of oil catch tanks in Prepared.
    Agreed This does provide a performance advantage enabling the car to essentially make its incoming fuel higher octane--->thus can tune more aggressively--->thus more power. Regardless of advantage, it's better for the cars. I see no problem with it.

    12 Allow modification of fenders and doors to accommodate larger wheels/tires in Modified.
    Agreed What Dynatorch might not realize is some cars have doors in very close proximity to the wheel arch. If you want to significantly increase that area, you might have to modify doors. Look at rear doors on some wide-body STis for example. I say no additional guidance on the extent or appearance of the modification. If they want to make them bigger than necessary, they will just hit more cones with it. If people don't like the cosmetics, you can come back to the issue next year.


    13 Allow removal of rear window in convertible hardtops OR allow removal of rear window in hardtop if vehicle is equipped with a roll cage in Modified.
    allow removal of rear window in hardtop if vehicle is equipped with a roll cage in Modified

    14 Allow windshield to be replaced with wire mesh or bracing if vehicle is equipped with roll cage in Modified.
    Agreed.

    15 Allow any aerodynamic device in Modified.
    Agreed

    16 Allow exhaust to exit to the side of the vehicle in front of the driver in Modified.
    Agreed but add must exit passenger side. This would give start workers and others a side with reduced noise and exhaust. It's also better for drivers.

    17 Add new class for AWD/4WD vehicles with OEM active differentials.
    NO Absolutly NO NO NO...... This will not just separate EVOs. It will add more complexity and classes reducing class size. If you don't like getting beat by EVOs and think its solely because of the car, then get one.. I don't own an EVO, and agree they are probably faster. There will always be some cars faster than others unless we make this a spec series. Please NO

    18 Eliminate parade laps and only allow course walks.
    NO this would make things dangerous and difficult for second run groups. There are many benefits to doing a drive through over walks. speed for example.

    19 Change maximum speed guideline from “not normally exceed 50 mph” back to 60 mph.
    Agreed. It probably wont change things much, but will give builders and organizers a little more flexibility.

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