Additional constructor class questions

[1lostsoldier]

Section 3.1 ~ Trophy Trucks, Crosskarts, Formula Cross, Legend cars, and
tube‐frame vehicles are eligible to compete in the Constructors category subject to
applicable preparation allowances.

Section 3.3 F 3. Engines must be naturally aspirated, internal combustion, passenger car or
light truck‐based, and with no more than four (4) cylinders or two (2) rotors.
Motorcycle, ATV, UTV and similar engines are not allowed.


These two rules seem to be at odds with each other. 3.1 says the vehicles listed are eligible but subject to preparation allowances. The term allowance is not the same as a requirement. An allowance is something you can do but do not have to do. In the constructor class you don't technically have a base vehicle that your are modifying so its rule set should be requirements not allowances.

That said I don't understand the rationale taking a trophy truck and then put a naturally aspirated 4 cylinder in it. These are fairly heavy vehicles that now would be extremely under powered for any motorsports event. With the other vehicles listed crosskarts, formula cross, and legends cars are so small no real production car drivetrain will fit in them so the rules basically make it impossible to use those.


-Ryan

[1lostsoldier]

Maybe if I reword my statement I can get some traction here.

Section 3.1 states one can use a "Crosskart" in the constructors category but is subject to applicable preparation allowances.

The definition of an allowance is something that is permitted but not mandated. This is an important distinction.

Because even section 3.3 F lists the Constructors Category as "Preparation allowances" it is consistent that none of those allowances are mandatory.

So with that said, the rules are clear then that any Trophy Truck, Crosskart, Formula Cross, Legend car, and
tube‐frame vehicle is eligible to compete as is per the existing rules.

To fix this the rules need to be amended to change allowances to requirements.

[Kentobeanz]

Hi Ryan,
Within the list of preparation allowances in 3.3 F nearly all of the individual rules use wording like "must" or "shall" that make them mandatory. Allowances is still the correct terminology, because a few rules are optional. 3.3.F.4 allows tube frame construction but it's not required, and 3.3.F.15 essentially says windshields aren't required but if you use one it must be X.

Your interpretation that Trophy Truck, CrossKart, Formula Cross, and Legend car, and tube-frame vehicles are already eligible is incorrect. However these vehicles can be made eligible if they are modified to meet the mandatory provisions within the class preparation allowances.

Would it be clearer if the current rules were rearranged into mandatory requirements and optional allowances?

Kent

[MoonTuned33]

Please help:

Can these 600/750/1000cc CrossKarts (Actual Official European Rally KrossKart Buggies) run in the local SCCA Rally Races in Midwest?

"Summary of changes to the RallyCross Rules for 2019:

1. Clarify that Crosskarts, Formula Cross, Legend cars, and tube-frame vehicles are eligible to compete in Constructors classes if they meet applicable preparation allowances (e.g. production-based engine). 3.1. ... The following types of vehicles are currently not eligible to compete in Stock, Prepared and Modified categories: ATVs, UTVs, side‐by‐sides, Trophy Trucks, Crosskarts, Formula Cross, Legend cars, and tube‐frame vehicles. Trophy Trucks, Crosskarts, Formula Cross, Legend cars, and tube‐frame vehicles are eligible to compete in the Constructors category subject to applicable preparation allowances."

F. Constructors Category

Constructors Two Wheel Drive (C2) Constructors All Wheel Drive (C4) Preparation allowances:

1. The Constructors Category is intended for four-wheeled vehicles altered in excess of the Modified Category allowances, such as dune buggies, sand rails, tube frame/chassis vehicles, kit cars and similar types of custom-built vehicles. 2. Minimum track is 42 inches measured from the center of the wheels. Maximum height is 90% of the average track width measured at the highest point of the roll cage. Minimum wheelbase is 72 inches measured from the center of the wheels. 3. Engines must be naturally aspirated, internal combustion, passenger car or light truck-based, and with no more than four (4) cylinders or two (2) rotors. Motorcycle, ATV, UTV and similar engines are not allowed."


Can the Euro/USA distributed production based Krosskarts listed below in links be approved? They are popular and use 600/750/1000cc type motorcyle engines? They are used in other sanctioned rally series.


"3. Engines must be naturally aspirated, internal combustion, passenger car or light truck-based, and with no more than four (4) cylinders or two (2) rotors. Motorcycle, ATV, UTV and similar engines are not allowed."


SCCA RallySprint/RallyTrials Rules:

"2 RallySprint vehicles will be classified into one of four categories:
a RallySprint Two-Wheel Drive Under 2.5 Liters (R2U) – for front- or rear-wheel drive vehicles with adjusted engine capacity of 2499 cc’s or less.
b RallySprint Two-Wheel Drive Over 2.5 Liters (R2O) – for front- or rear-wheel drive vehicles with adjusted engine capacity of 2.5 liters or greater.
c RallySprint Four-Wheel Drive Under 2.5 Liters (R4U) – for all- or four-wheel drive vehicles with adjusted engine capacity 2499 cc’s or less.
d RallySprint Four-Wheel Drive Over 2.5 Liters (R4O) -- for all- or four-wheel drive vehicles with adjusted engine capacity of 2.5 liters or greater.

Adjusted engine capacity is the actual displacement for normally-aspirated engines or 1.4 times the actual displacement for vehicles with forced induction (turbochargers, superchargers).

C Other classification systems will be considered and should be listed on the sanction application.

D Vehicles that meet the safety requirements and are currently log-booked to compete in other non-SCCA racing or rally series, such as SCCA, Rally America, GRC, NASA, SCORE, FIA, and USAC, are eligible to compete at the discretion and approval of SCCA or Event Chairman."


These are here in the USA and being raced (They are also the baseline for European CrossKart Rally Racing and are/have been added to rally series)

https://www.fxautocross.com

https://www.fastspeed.us

http://crosskartsusa.com

https://www.sierra-cars.com

http://www.rd-crosskart.dk/

Thank you!

[1lostsoldier]

Hi Ryan,
Within the list of preparation allowances in 3.3 F nearly all of the individual rules use wording like "must" or "shall" that make them mandatory. Allowances is still the correct terminology, because a few rules are optional. 3.3.F.4 allows tube frame construction but it's not required, and 3.3.F.15 essentially says windshields aren't required but if you use one it must be X.

Your interpretation that Trophy Truck, CrossKart, Formula Cross, and Legend car, and tube-frame vehicles are already eligible is incorrect. However these vehicles can be made eligible if they are modified to meet the mandatory provisions within the class preparation allowances.

Would it be clearer if the current rules were rearranged into mandatory requirements and optional allowances?

Kent

Thanks for your reply Kent.

The root of the issue is using incorrect language, an allowance cannot be mandatory. I realize that's how they are currently written but its not the proper use of those terms.

I would agree if the current constructor class rules were re-organized into requirements and allowances it would be better defined. I also would steer away from mandatory requirements and optional allowances as those are redundant terms, requirements are always mandatory and allowances are always optional.

-Ryan

[Bob Martin]

It might not matter, but don't Legend cars have Yamaha FX09 engines? Does this mean they have to swap to an automotive engine to run? Or, can they run the stock motorcycle engine? If they can run a motorcycle engine, why can't others?

[gsxnut]

Bob,

You would have to swap an automotive engine into the Legends car.

Thanks,

Mark